Talk:Key:opening hours:covid19

Alternatives

Sorry I can't read French but, consider temporary:opening_hours=* @ (Covid-19)? Proposed_features/temporary_(conditional) -- Kovposch (talk) 09:32, 25 March 2020 (UTC)

Hello, thanks for suggesting this alternative. I see that it has only 5 uses worldwide while being around since 2016. Though "temporary:" prefix is very clear, "opening_hours:*=*" variants are way more popular and allows to keep a simple syntax as values. If a wider consensus is reached, we can still migrate to your suggested tag. --PanierAvide (talk) 09:40, 25 March 2020 (UTC)

Thanks for the quick reply. Problem is the key suffix variant are mostly for general properties, not specific events. Compare xmas:*=* in use (viz xmas:opening_hours=*), which is a regular and permanent event. This makes Covid-19 clear as being a one-time property, and Covid-19 measures may change suddenly. temporary:*=* would have other advantages, such as allowing more time range details to be added. There is a quite a variety of keys used:

temporary:opening_hours	temporary:days_on	temporary:days_off	temporary:day_on	temporary:day_on

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-- Kovposch (talk) 09:54, 25 March 2020 (UTC)

the tag keys have been deprecated for some time for opening_hours. but I like the xmas: variant. pandemic:opening_hours might be a tag that is future proof and can just be used in case a country does something in regards to any pandemic, not just covid19.

--LKS90 (talk) 22:44, 31 March 2020 (UTC)

If this pandemic is going to be mutating for the foreseeable future, the generic tag makes sense. On the other hand, if this pandemic goes away within finite time period, then the present suffix is better since it represents the specific situation, making future tag removal easier. Also, should we have another pandemic in a few years, I assume businesses will come up with new opening hours, making generic tag more confusing. Due to that, I propose we don't future-proof it: keep the covid19 suffix for the duration of the current pandemic, and remove it when businesses go back to normal operations. --HubMiner (talk) 13:10, 14 May 2020 (UTC)

Most of the stores in US have special open hours reserved for people in special categories: usually people over certain age (60?), medical workers, police, firefighters, ambulance workers. General public is discouraged or disallowed during those hours. Example: https://www.costco.com/covid-updates.html I propose adding an example how to capture this:

• opening_hours:covid19=08:00-21:00 on || 06:00-08:00 special "over 60, medics, emergency responders"

--HubMiner (talk) 13:34, 14 May 2020 (UTC)

Usability

The Dutch OSM community has determined that the use of opening_hours:covid19 is completely unsustainable and unverifiable. No one keeps this data, it is highly outdated and also missing in many cases. There is currently a discussion on the forum (#15) about removing this tag. --Marczoutendijk (talk) 16:32, 30 December 2021 (UTC)

After some discussion I removed all opening_hours:covid19=* tags that haven't been edited since 2021-11-14 when a new lockdown heavily impacted opening hours in the Netherlands. For details see the forum discussion and changeset 115830635. --501ghost (talk) 14:02, 6 January 2022 (UTC)

I've reviewed "opening hours:covid19" tags locally where it's clear that they don't add value, but just removing the tags without survey isn't a good option as some places have reopened, some have closed for good and some have permanently changed opening hours. SomeoneElse (talk) 16:26, 14 February 2022 (UTC)

Predicting the future

@Mateusz_Konieczny You surely don't actually mean "At this point it is clear that COVID19 is not going to disappear" do you? If you actually do know what's going to happen in the future, I'm sure that many people would be interested to know the result of next year's Kentucky Derby :) If what you actually mean is that that "we appear to be moving from a pandemic to an endemic phase" and that "countries are moving to different ways to deal with it" then please say that; don't say "using X tag is wrong" but instead say something like "if new opening hours or other rules seem likely to be permanent, then please ensure that they are in "opening hours" rather than "opening hours:covid19". SomeoneElse (talk) 16:21, 14 February 2022 (UTC)

Thanks for feedback, I attempted to improve it. Please let me know if it can be improved further (or even better, just edit it )@SomeoneElse: Mateusz Konieczny (talk) 17:11, 14 February 2022 (UTC)

"You surely don't actually mean "At this point it is clear that COVID19 is not going to disappear" do you?" - I mean it, going by current situation and humanity track of eradication efforts and nature of COVID19 it is pretty clear that it is not going to disappear and stay for foreseeable future (it is going to be closer to flu rather than smallpox as far as its prevalence goes) (and I am willing to bet actual money on that if someone is willing to take bet). Obviously it is possible that someone will produce 100% effective vaccine or it is going to mutate into far less harmful variant making restrictions of various kind unnecessary etc Mateusz Konieczny (talk) 17:11, 14 February 2022 (UTC)

I've rewritten the first section to not make any predictions about what will happen in the future (which doesn't really help here), but to make it clear that in many cases it does make sense to use opening_hours=* instead of opening_hours:covid19=* now, while also suggesting when opening_hours:covid19=* might still be relevant. SomeoneElse (talk) 12:37, 17 February 2022 (UTC)

Resolved: resolved, I think. Thanks for help in making it more fitting for OSM documentation Mateusz Konieczny (talk) 11:14, 18 September 2023 (UTC)

Time heals all wounds

Hello.

3 years later, businesses no longer entertain the notion that COVID19 will cause a temporary change in opening hours. All businesses have either just adjusted their hours to new standard hours, or just remained using the previous opening hours.

I don’t know how the situation is in the rest of the world, but should we consider discouraging the use of this tagging going forward? —SherbetS (talk) 18:29, 23 January 2023 (UTC)

Yes, at this point this tag does not make sense - at least in Poland. I expect the same in other places Mateusz Konieczny (talk) 04:23, 24 January 2023 (UTC)

I also think that ther is not realy a use for this tag anymore. I noticed that the status is "deprecated" in the english and I think russian wiki. In the other languages I think it is "in use" at the moment. This does not make sense. Is it okay to just change the status in all languages to "deprecated" or would it be better to do some kind of voting first?--Os-emmer (talk) 10:58, 14 September 2023 (UTC)

I think that updating wiki translations would be a good idea, this was quite thoroughly discussed (see links). If someone disagrees and has valid reasons for that they should comment there Mateusz Konieczny (talk) 11:07, 18 September 2023 (UTC)

Just do it. 501ghost (talk) 17:55, 18 September 2023 (UTC)