Talk:Nonexistent features

Is this the main page to discuss how to treat objects that existed at one point, were mapped but no longer exist now?

Is there a page of examples of how to treat (for example businesses that have closed down and turned into something else) these situations?

I am wondering because if the object contains info like address info, it would be helpful to have it clearly written (here or somewhere else). IanVG (talk) 17:26, 25 April 2022 (UTC)

AFAIK it is the main page (I created it because there was no such documentation at all). Feel free to add more content, even if not entirely sure (in the worst case I would edit it or we could start discussion how to describe things here) Mateusz Konieczny (talk) 15:59, 26 April 2022 (UTC)

"if the object contains info like address info" - it depends on (1) is this address present on some other objects (2) is address still existing given removal of object Mateusz Konieczny (talk) 15:59, 26 April 2022 (UTC)

Former cemetery

I do not agree with this: "Even if there was cemetery here some time ago, it is gone without traces so it should be deleted from OSM.", a cemetery in many cultures remains a cemetery til "eternity". "Gone without traces" is likely not true, just dig and you'll find the bones of those who have been buried there. --Dieterdreist (talk) 08:54, 27 July 2023 (UTC)

Can you give examples of places consisted as some memorial place despite no traces whatsoever being present? And how such places are mapped in OSM? I expect that cases where this applies will have some kind of memorial and memorial will be mapped. Note also that another very likely situation is that such place never ever had cemetery and it was simply badly mapped, I suspect that is what happened in this case. "cemetery in many cultures remains a cemetery til "eternity"" which cultures? "you'll find the bones of those who have been buried there" not in cases where (1) remains were moved (2) or cemetery never existed Mateusz Konieczny (talk) 10:37, 27 July 2023 (UTC)

I would ask a similar question, can you give an example of a former cemetery that has vanished without any traces remaining? Some mappers are deleting information based on a superficial glimpse on the site, so they didn’t spot any traces despite there were. We should ask people to caution before removing things and double check and ask the one who mapped it. If a cemetery was mapped where there never was, sure, let’s remove it, but if you walk in Cairo and see a residential area, it could still also be an ancient cemetery at the same time. —-Dieterdreist (talk) 19:09, 27 July 2023 (UTC)

[1] or [2] (memorial is mappable or [3] - note that we are mapping in OSM currently existing cemetery infrastructure, not past cemetery existence or whether there are any human remain buried there. Mateusz Konieczny (talk) 23:38, 27 July 2023 (UTC)

I don’t see that infrastructure is required for cemeteries. The amenity=graveyard tag clearly is also for graveyards where nobody has been buried for years or more, the landuse=cemetery tag is not very explicit when to apply, and the historic=cemetery doesn’t write at all what I would have expected and has a disclaimer which suggests the text is not well thought out yet. So no, a cemetery doesn’t require currently ongoing burials, it could be “full” and still be a cemetery. —Dieterdreist (talk) 06:27, 28 July 2023 (UTC)

I mentioned "cemetery infrastructure" not "ongoing burials". Ganges has ongoing burials but is not tagged as cemetery and should not be, I think. And full/empty cemetery may have graves / space prepared for burials even if no burials are happening right now. Mateusz Konieczny (talk) 06:34, 28 July 2023 (UTC)

Maybe "cemetery infrastructure" is not the best phrasing, but mapping cemetery in any of places I listed as example would be a mistake, including one listed on the page. Though feel free to start thread on tagging mailing list or official forum to discuss with wider community (just let me know about discussion) Mateusz Konieczny (talk) 06:35, 28 July 2023 (UTC)