Talk:Key:trees
Proposals for the Trees list
Use this section to submit new trees and berry shrubs
trees=hop plants
Suggested by User:VonLausitzOelpen]] on the Proposed features/orchard. See Wikipedia:hops FrViPofm 14:48, 30 October 2009 (UTC)
- I like this proposal. FrViPofm 14:48, 30 October 2009 (UTC)
- should that be 'hop_plants'? but should _plants should appear in a tree sub catagory?
I like having _trees plural as it might prevent duplicate spellings, e.g. trees=apple trees=apples --Loshu 07:58, 20 November 2009 (UTC)
Cleanup of tree list
There was a mix up of common names of fruits like 'apple' and the plural 'apples'. Also of the denotation of the type of plant: tree, and plural trees, palm/palms
Last but not least the list contains palm plants (coconut palm), shrub (blackberry, blueberry, ...)
Most common before clean up was fruit + plant type. Therefor the standard should be as this example: apple_trees (fruit + plural of plant type).
This is my pow on this matter... --EinKonstanzer (talk) 00:41, 8 July 2014 (UTC)
Next cleanup - without translations
The existing list with several implemented translations is a bit confusing. There exist already a list in French and Portugues and Japanese within landuse=orchard. I propose to eliminate the translations in the english list. The translations could be done in separate language pages, as it is common usage in the wiki.
Any objections? --Rudolf (talk) 13:06, 15 July 2014 (UTC)
- Done. Created also two language-pages in German and French. The old list can be found at Key:trees/list for historical reference. --Rudolf (talk) 06:56, 22 July 2014 (UTC)
Missing values
In landuse=orchard are mentioned several tree-types which are missing in the tree-list. These are:
- trees=rubber_trees
with produce=latex - trees=oil_palms
- trees=oaks with produce=truffles or produce=cork
Already used values, missing in tree-list:
- trees=kiwi_trees
- trees=nectorine_trees
- trees=cork_oaks - IMO better than trees=oaks with produce=cork.
New proposal
- trees=truffle_oaks - IMO better than trees=oaks with produce=truffles. See truffletree
I propose to add these values to the list. --Rudolf (talk) 05:48, 17 July 2014 (UTC)
- Orchard has a distinct meaning, related to fruit trees grown for their fruit. It can be extended to some non tree shrubby crops, including cane fruit (raspberries, et.c.), but should not be used for non food production. Rubber trees, oil palms, cork oak et.c. should be excluded, if only because most English speakers will tend not to use this tag. I suggest that these crops be placed under 'landuse = plantation'. Indigomc (talk) 06:53, 12 March 2015 (UTC)
- Oil palms are grown for their fruit, just like olive trees, and both are often used to make vegetable oil. It's true that rubber trees and cork oak could be considered forestry products instead, but there is some overlap. In the tropics most "plantations" are tagged with landuse=orchard, including trees=tea_plants which are grown for their leaves for drinks (sort of food?), coffee bushes, and banana plants, so it's possible that people will think to use landuse=orchard for rubber tree plantations, rather than landuse=forest --Jeisenbe (talk) 13:27, 17 August 2019 (UTC)
There is a section missing for the polar region with the famous polarberries. --Polarbear w (talk) 19:33, 8 October 2019 (UTC)
Proposal: Sambucus
elder is the common name of Sambucus. It is a very common plant and many people search for it to produce e.g. sirups.
- Umm These produce berries and flowers. The product (note the T rather than an E) of syrup requires some processing. Warin61 (talk) 04:41, 19 January 2017 (UTC)
A preference for the key produce rather than trees.
I prefer the produce=* key rather than trees; as the same values can be used to indicate what is sold in a shop, the same scheme can be used for any farm, forest, aquaculture ... anything that has produce rather than have individual schemes for each landuse tag. Warin61 (talk) 04:47, 19 January 2017 (UTC)
- The tag trees=* was approved for use with orchards and is very commonly used. Some database users (eg iD editor) prefer to have different property keys for different main features. This shouldn't be a big consideration, but there is no really issue with looking for trees=* for orchards, produce=* for aquaculture and farmland and forestry, and crop=* for farmland and meadows, and product=* for industrial agricultural facilities. It's normally to use different property keys for different features and characteristics, depending on what common English language term is used. --Jeisenbe (talk) 04:49, 17 August 2019 (UTC)
Missing/wrong keys
Hi, for an OSM app (StreetComplete) I am creating a database of OSM tags for crops/fruits. Most of them seem to be under the trees key, that's why I am (also) posting here. For some background information why I am doing this, see: https://github.com/westnordost/StreetComplete/issues/368 TL;DR: For a new quest (question) in StretComplete we needed to parse data on worldwide crop usage and the results need to be converted into into OSM tags.
Going through the used OSM tags, I noticed some were missing here and some were wrong and could be edited by a bulk edit. The current database of OSM tags is here: https://github.com/rugk/crops-parser/blob/master/osmcrops.csv
--rugk (talk) 12:26, 3 July 2017 (UTC)
- There is an OSMwiki page on produce that you may find useful https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:produce
- Also you might consider the leisure=pitch with missing or incorrect sport=* for your app ... the sport=football is one in particular that is popular but not correct in OSM. Warin61 (talk) 23:20, 3 July 2017 (UTC)
- First I'm just a contributor there, but as for the sports issue there is already a quest: https://github.com/westnordost/StreetComplete/issues/180 So leisure=pitch is handled. Do you want to say that "sport=football" should also be a question? --rugk (talk) 09:18, 4 July 2017 (UTC)
Used in OSM, but missing in wiki
source: https://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/keys/trees
- oil_palms (2nd most usage on OSM, 16.90%)
- rubber_trees (on https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:landuse%3Dorchard)
- pitaya_plants (1 028, 1.26%)
strawberry_plants- cacao_trees
- coca_plants
- cherimoya_trees (144x)
- pomegranate_trees
- pecan_trees
- piper_plants (pepper and so on)
- nopal_plants
- lime_trees
(or better tag them as trees=lemon_trees?) - shal_trees /(according to Wikipedia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shorea_robusta the name is, however, missing an "a" here: shala tree)
- blackcurrant_plants
- cashew_trees
- eucalyptus_trees
--rugk (talk) 12:26, 3 July 2017 (UTC)
- Because something is used in OSM does not make it correct. A prime example is the above "strawberry_plants" as these are not trees nor shrubs. There are a runner covering the ground but not going to any height. Lemon trees are not lime trees either. See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citrus Then the question of if something is a tree or a shrub, will OSM distinguish between them? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blackcurrant Warin61 (talk) 23:09, 3 July 2017 (UTC)
Wrongly used in OSM
source: https://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/keys/trees
but more used than the wiki-ones:
- trees=palm is also there (379, 0.47%), although trees=oil_palms also exists (mentioned in the wiki), and there is "trees=palms"
- agave (104, 0.13%), the right tag according to the wiki is "trees=agave_plants", but less used
- also stupid: "commercial" (wiki warning, …)
- blueberry (okay, under "*berries", but also wrong als "*plants" is suggested)
- nectorine_trees (famous typo here, it is a nectarine; also putting under trees=peach_trees may be better; see EN-Wikipedia: “Peach and nectarines are the same species, even though they are regarded commercially as different fruits.”)
- boutique (???)
- baobab (wrong syntax)
- tamarind (wrong syntax)
- macadamia (wrong syntax)
- ananas_plants (should be pineapple_plants; maybe German did not know the correct translation?)
- kiwi_trees, AFAIK these are plants, not trees, but the tree tag is more popular; there is also crop=kiwi
- neem (wrong syntax)
- sapodilla (wrong syntax)
- manngo_tree (typo 4x)
- rubber-tree (typo 3x)
- palm_oil (…)
- christmas_trees (also wrong, AFAIK)
- fir_trees (what about this?)
- plive_trees (typo)
- fig_trees (is this correct?)
- strawberry_plants (crops=strawberry would be correct)
So the palm thing likely needs a clean-up and someone to decide what tag to use. And some others too. Also the trees=*berry_plants example you give in this wiki is strange, as you later violate this rule anyway by specifying blueberry, bayberry, bayberry as valid tags. And these do not even use the plural form…
--rugk (talk) 12:26, 3 July 2017 (UTC)
- @Rugk: Nice to get to know the StreetComplete developer. I'm also willing to clean this tag up.
IMHO changing agave_plants to agave and adding oil_palms and rubber_trees should be uncontroversial. And: The mate tree grows in subtropical regions.--Ethylisocyanat (talk) 22:51, 30 July 2017 (UTC)
- @Rugk: Ok. I've tried to run your crops-parser, but with harvested_area insted. May I send you some additions to the osmcrops.csv file?--Ethylisocyanat (talk) 00:01, 1 August 2017 (UTC)
- It would be better to discuss this on GitHub, but generally: Sure, PRs are always appreciated. In this case, however, put that data into a new file (maybe osmcrops_farmland.csv or so) and possibly rename the other one (osmcrops_streetcomplete.csv may be a good idea). The thing is for StreetComplete we only needed a subset of all possible OSM tags, see https://github.com/rugk/crops-parser/wiki/Inclusion-conditions As I said it is a subset, so you may also add the tags from the current CSV to the new one and name it "osmcrops_all.csv" afterwards, or so. --rugk (talk) 20:30, 1 August 2017 (UTC)
- And BTW: The format of the CSV may maybe change to include the "produce" value. See https://github.com/rugk/crops-parser/issues/36#issuecomment-319489300 --rugk (talk) 20:38, 1 August 2017 (UTC)
@Rugk: I'm a Github beginner and was too dumb to commit my changes. So I've uploaded them at https://github.com/rugk/crops-parser/issues/46
- https://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/keys/crop#values should now also be a little bit cleaner.
--Ethylisocyanat (talk) 18:42, 3 August 2017 (UTC)
Adding trees keys
We are currently in the process of collecting data for the OpenStreetMap app StreetComplete. Therefore we identified some missing crops (or, in this case, trees), which we'd like to add.
See https://github.com/westnordost/StreetComplete/issues/368 for the whole project. Using a parser (https://github.com/rugk/crops-parser) we identified some missing crops. Before adding them, I'll list them here, so you can discuss anything if wanted:
Nutmeg- mace and cardamoms trees=nutmeg_trees orchard Kola nuts trees=kola_trees orchard Maté trees=mate_plants orchard Jojoba seed trees=jojoba_plants orchard Cranberries trees=cranberry orchard Grapefruit (inc. pomelos) trees=grapefruit_trees orchard
I've added another list for the crop keys on the corresponding wiki page.
Happy to hear any feedback. --rugk (talk) 19:10, 8 July 2017 (UTC)
- So, I've finally added them. I mostly put them under "tropical area", but maybe some of them (can) also grow in subtropical areas etc. Feel free to move them around. In any case this is now done
.
Obsolete
I think these tags (trees=* and crop=*) should be obsolete because we have more accurate genus=*, species=*, taxon=*: not universal (only for trees and you must also know about crop=* - they are have some intersections), and it's plural instead of singular.VlIvYur (talk) 09:33, 23 October 2018 (UTC)
- The tags genus, species and taxon are normally in latin, rather than in English, so they are much harder for ordinary mapper to use and more difficult to translate. --Jeisenbe (talk) 04:58, 17 August 2019 (UTC)
Christmas tree farms?
Has this tag been used for any christmas tree farms, locations where small, trimmed conifers are grown and cut down each year for Christmas? Another user just added this to "see also" section. --Jeisenbe (talk) 14:34, 11 December 2020 (UTC)
Suggesting "trees" for plants that aren't trees
Currently the page suggests to use the key trees=* for lots of plants that aren't trees, e.g. hops, blueberry plants, pineapple, cranberries and many more herbaceous plants and shrubs. This seems just the result of wikifiddling, or has this madness been voted for? IMHO we should fix it asap, as it is not a widely established practise yet. What do you think? --Dieterdreist (talk) 17:04, 17 June 2024 (UTC)