Proposal:Deprecate maxspeed:seasonal:winter
| Deprecate maxspeed:seasonal:winter | |
|---|---|
| Proposal status: | Approved (active) |
| Proposed by: | Arrival-spring |
| Tagging: | maxspeed:seasonal:winter=* |
| Applies to: | 
|
| Definition: | Speed limit in winter |
| Statistics: |
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| Draft started: | 2023-05-23 |
| RFC start: | 2023-05-23 never posted on tagging mailing |
| Vote start: | 2023-06-06 |
| Vote end: | 2023-07-04 |
Proposal
Deprecate maxspeed:seasonal:winter and recommend the usage of maxspeed:conditional with e.g. 100 @ winter
Rationale
Having another key to deal with when parsing speed limit data which potentially conflicts with maxspeed:conditional makes it more difficult for data consumers, and also for mapper with knowing what key to use.
There was a discussion in 2019 started in late February, was active in March, with continued activity in April which did not show wide support or strong opinions on the matter. Some people said at the time that maxspeed:conditional would be preferred.
Although some people suggest that maxspeed:conditional is tricky to deal with for data consumers, one does not need to fully support all possible cases to be able to interpret simple cases such as weather conditions, summer or winter. There is not a good reason why winter should be treated differently, and require a special key, compared to the other conditions. Additionally, the conditional restriction format is a standard format that has been widely used, so anyone wanting to use speed limit information would need to deal with it anyway. For example, OSMAnd and CycleOSM support conditional restrictions/speed limits.
maxspeed:conditional is used for other time periods (e.g. Nov-Mar) and also for weather (snow, wet) so it makes sense to be used for winter too.
The key was first used before conditional restrictions were, so that is likely why it was introduced as another key.
Features/Pages affected
Mark maxspeed:seasonal:winter as deprecated and link to it from Deprecated features.
External discussions
- https://community.openstreetmap.org/t/rfc-proposal-to-deprecate-maxspeedwinter/99377
- https://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/tagging/2023-June/067357.html
- https://community.openstreetmap.org/t/voting-deprecate-maxspeedwinter/99863
- https://community.openstreetmap.org/t/crosspost-voting-deprecate-maxspeedwinter/99868
Comments
Please comment on the discussion page.
Voting
Voting on this proposal has been closed.
It was approved with 26 votes for, 2 votes against and 1 abstention.
I approve this proposal. --Arrival-spring (talk) 13:30, 6 June 2023 (UTC)- I approve this proposal. --Shaun das Schaf (talk) 13:52, 6 June 2023 (UTC)
- I approve this proposal. If the winter rules apply in a specific date range, then that date range can be used in the conditional syntax. If it is tied to the weather, then the suggested generic
@ winteris fine. --JeroenvanderGun (talk) 14:59, 6 June 2023 (UTC) - I approve this proposal. --mnalis (talk) 00:58, 7 June 2023 (UTC)
- I invalid this proposal. rfcStartDate = 2023-05-23 never posted on tagging mailing -> set status to invalid, please post RFC on tagging mailing too Marc marc (talk) 01:32, 7 June 2023 (UTC)
- I followed the proposal process and so requested and rerequested that the RFC be sent to the tagging mailing list. However the process does not say what one should do when that does not happen. --Arrival-spring (talk) 11:56, 7 June 2023 (UTC)
- As possible solution, send RFC to the tagging mailing list, set status to "proposed", rfcStartDate = 'date of sending to the mailing list' and process as usual. Something B (talk) 12:51, 7 June 2023 (UTC)
- Or just give 4 weeks for voting instead (2 weeks since the mailing list announcement and then 2 weeks normal voting)? Then it might be time for another vote on announcements to save this from happening again. --Arrival-spring (talk) 15:18, 7 June 2023 (UTC)
- As possible solution, send RFC to the tagging mailing list, set status to "proposed", rfcStartDate = 'date of sending to the mailing list' and process as usual. Something B (talk) 12:51, 7 June 2023 (UTC)
- I followed the proposal process and so requested and rerequested that the RFC be sent to the tagging mailing list. However the process does not say what one should do when that does not happen. --Arrival-spring (talk) 11:56, 7 June 2023 (UTC)
I have comments but abstain from voting on this proposal. Same as Marc marc. Something B (talk) 08:06, 7 June 2023 (UTC)
I oppose this proposal. It is not clear what the main user community of this tag, i.e. Finland, thinks about this proposal --voschix (talk) 14:36, 7 June 2023 (UTC)- I oppose this proposal. This should be decided by the finish community --chris66 (talk) 06:56, 8 June 2023 (UTC)
- I approve this proposal. --Westnordost (talk) 11:50, 8 June 2023 (UTC)
- I approve this proposal. (mapper from Finland) with the condition that the Key:maxspeed:conditional will document "100@winter" as a valid example. In my opinion it is not convenient to use date ranges when the switching date is country-wide and decided yearly by a Finnish authority (information in finnish). For Finland, it might even be available as open data already. --U9f4y1f941f9h9 (talk) 14:47, 8 June 2023 (UTC)
- I have added it as an example to that page (there are some uses already). It would be good to have a picture, I couldn't see anything on Road signs in Finland or are the signs physically changed somehow? --Arrival-spring (talk) 15:09, 8 June 2023 (UTC)
- Yes, when the speed limit is lowered in the autumn, there are people going through the roads, stopping at every speed limit sign and either replacing the normal physical speed limit sign with another physical sign showing a lower winter speed limit or covering the normal speed limit with a physical speed limit sign showing the winter speed limit. Here you can see an image of this happening: link to an Iltalehti online newspaper article. The same thing is done in the spring, except then the maintenance crew is replacing the winter speed limit sign with the normal speed limit, or if the normal speed limit was just hidden behind the winter one, removing the winter speed limit sign from the traffic sign pole and revealing the normal speed limit underneath the temporary sign. The signs look the same both in summer and in winter but they have a different number value on them. You can not determine if a speed limit is a winter one as there is no winter-specific speed limit values that would not appear in summertime. Some roads, mainly newer motorways and important national roads, have a system of remotely changeable speed limit signs. Here is an image of that: link to Yle's image. The speed limit is automatically lowered in the winter and raised in the summer. It can also be remotely adjusted temporarily depending on traffic, road and/or weather conditions. You can see the current speed limit displayed on these signs on Fintraffic's web map (in English; select "Variable signs" from the menu in the right side). These road segments are mapped as maxspeed:variable=yes. --Viima (talk) 06:00, 9 June 2023 (UTC)
- I have added it as an example to that page (there are some uses already). It would be good to have a picture, I couldn't see anything on Road signs in Finland or are the signs physically changed somehow? --Arrival-spring (talk) 15:09, 8 June 2023 (UTC)
- I approve this proposal. --Tordanik 10:00, 9 June 2023 (UTC)
- I approve this proposal. Something B (talk) 16:08, 9 June 2023 (UTC)
- I approve this proposal. --Adiatmad (talk) 03:54, 15 June 2023 (UTC)
- I approve this proposal. --快乐的老鼠宝宝 (talk) 08:52, 15 June 2023 (UTC)
- I approve this proposal. --Riiga (talk) 06:11, 16 June 2023 (UTC)
- I approve this proposal. As long as exact dates are preferred over the name of the season in cases where this is possible --Famlam (talk) 07:18, 17 June 2023 (UTC)
- I approve this proposal. --Popball (talk) 11:22, 18 June 2023 (UTC)
- I approve this proposal. --Uboot (talk) 13:09, 18 June 2023 (UTC)
- I approve this proposal. --EneaSuper (talk) 14:36, 18 June 2023 (UTC)
- I approve this proposal. --Geonick (talk) 18:28, 18 June 2023 (UTC)
- I approve this proposal. --Aury88 (talk) 06:05, 19 June 2023 (UTC)
- I approve this proposal. --Pantufla (talk) 07:34, 19 June 2023 (UTC)
- I approve this proposal. --Fincent (talk) 09:32, 19 June 2023 (UTC)
- I approve this proposal. --scai (talk) 11:49, 19 June 2023 (UTC)
- I approve this proposal. --Michi (talk) 20:14, 19 June 2023 (UTC)
- I approve this proposal. from France --Al-Hun (talk) 08:21, 20 June 2023 (UTC)
- I approve this proposal. --Aquarix (talk) 12:28, 25 June 2023 (UTC)
{{vote|yes}} I support simplicity --~~~~—Preceding unsigned comment added by Heilbron (talk • contribs) 13:18, 18 June 2023- I approve this proposal. --Kjon (talk) 15:30, 25 June 2023 (UTC)
- I approve this proposal. Only if winter is approved as a condition for maxspeed:conditional as there is no specific date for the change. --Viima (talk) 11:30, 2 July 2023 (UTC)