Talk:Creating a page describing key or value

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When mentioning better tagging is OK? =

"the wiki is not a tool to direct mappers to any specific tagging"

Well, it is not true. We have deprecated features for example and it is OK to mention clearly problematic tagging as bad idea without going though a full scale proposal process. See later theoretical exaple of shop=fresh_vegetables_and_fruits.

Maybe mention that it is not a tool to invent new rules? But existing ones may be applied? Mateusz Konieczny (talk) 11:12, 16 January 2021 (UTC)

Clarification required

I'm having difficulty figuring out what is meant by "while a wider community did care for a specific tagging scheme." After several minutes of trying to parse it, I still can't figure out what point was being made. --Brian de Ford (talk) 13:36, 20 January 2021 (UTC)

I am also unable to understand it :) Should be better now (@Brian de Ford: Mateusz Konieczny (talk) 14:01, 20 January 2021 (UTC)
:) --Brian de Ford (talk) 14:08, 20 January 2021 (UTC)

How many worms in the can?

The page says "To start: feel free to create documentation for tags that are used already and there is no wiki page for them!"

How many uses is enough? And does that number change depending if it is a new top-level key, a new sub-key, or a new value for an existing key?

This is a can of worms. We have a conflict between "any key you like" and "you need a vote to introduce a new tag." The result is, too frequently, that somebody invents a new value or even a new key but doesn't document it. People then find it with taginfo and guess what was intended. The result can be a tag with very blurry usage and many arguments on the mailing lists about what it means, or was intended to mean, or should mean.

If a key is used just once, does that count as "in use" or "de facto" (I'm still unsure as to the difference). Or should we have a new status "I just made this up"? How many uses must a new key or value have (possibly modified by how many different mappers have used it) before we can document it?

We need rigidly defined areas of doubt and uncertainty. --Brian de Ford (talk) 14:23, 20 January 2021 (UTC)

It is fine to document tag used even once, but I would use "status=proposed" Definitely not "de facto". Note that if it is created as tag documentation rather than as proposal page - it is fine for others to describe tag as pointless duplicate of another tag (if it is a pointless duplicate of another tag) and so on Mateusz Konieczny (talk) 14:33, 20 January 2021 (UTC)
"you need a vote to introduce a new tag." - I would say rather "proposal process is useful, please consider it". Vote is not needed to introduce new tag (but overview pages may exclude rarely used tags and admit rarely used tags that got approved in vote) Mateusz Konieczny (talk) 14:35, 20 January 2021 (UTC)

Live Example

I just made a new article, Tag:man_made=avalanche_protection by following this guide here. Feel free to look at it and take the blame for all of its deficiencies :)

The "copy from existing" I found here only after coming up with myself. Perhaps ready for use templates (key|tag|value) would be great for starters.--Hungerburg (talk) 19:21, 21 January 2021 (UTC)

I will not create that page, because I consider the subject does not fit under barrier, because barrier is about traffic, at least, that what the wiki says. At most I would create a redirect to the other ;)--Hungerburg (talk) 21:17, 21 January 2021 (UTC)

Hello Mateusz - this was not meant to take you away from your own errands, but the effort is appreciated. Thank you. I hope you can take home a little of the live example to this guide here.

Beforehand I wanted to do a kind of popularity-contest between man-made and barrier, to find out, not just the total numbers, but, how many different people have set each. But I could not do it in taginfo. Do you have any idea? The article here mentions that in an aside, that there isn't, did I get that right?--Hungerburg (talk) 20:39, 21 January 2021 (UTC)

Number of different users with last edit from taginfo works for keys, not for values. Sadly, I am not aware about any simple way to get that number (even for keys taginfo number is not too useful - note case of single account importing new key and many people editing it. As result number of distinct accounts on object with given key may be large even if it was used by a single person) Mateusz Konieczny (talk) 20:44, 21 January 2021 (UTC)
To get info about popularity among mappers you can try asking on some forum like tagging mailing list or some local place where people discuss - OSM Community Index will have info where for example Switzerland community is discussing things Mateusz Konieczny (talk) 20:46, 21 January 2021 (UTC)
Pascal Neis was so nice to craft an overpass turbo https://overpass-turbo.eu/s/12F6 query, that in this case, where most of the features are on their first version, can help shed some light on the spread of one kind of mapping among mappers, its distributedness, so to say.--Hungerburg (talk) 09:20, 22 January 2021 (UTC)

Choose another base page for creating key pages

The "Page creation" section says "Key:house may be a good base for key page". The house=* page says that, as of December 2020, over 85% of uses of this tag are in Ireland.

Could another key be chosen as a base for creating key pages? A key with a similar page format but whose use is more widespread globally would be better. --Dcapillae (talk) 13:40, 30 January 2021 (UTC)

Note that text itself does not really matter - I selected this page as it is fairly short and has various relatively simple examples of wikicode Mateusz Konieczny (talk) 08:54, 31 January 2021 (UTC)
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