Talk:Tag:indoor=yes
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indoor vs. outdoor
@Mateusz Konieczny - I understand that you are trying to clarify why there are two different antonyms, kind of forming a matrix of possibilities indoor=yes/no and outdoor=yes/no. Apparently they have developed from different perspectives. A simple object like a water tap can only be in one of the spheres, thus indoor=yes/no is sufficient. More complex objects, like sports centres, can cover both spheres, thus the full indoor/outdoor matrix is necessary. --Polarbear w (talk) 00:49, 17 January 2022 (UTC)
- Thanks, I missed this case! Mateusz Konieczny (talk) 13:20, 17 January 2022 (UTC)
- How can an object (complex or not) be "inside a building, a shelter or a room" (indoors) and "attached to i[t]s [...] outdoors" at the same time? Sorry, I don't get it. I also find the new Key:outdoor#Example more confusing than enlightening. Can you give a link to some OSM object where you think this tagging makes sense? --Hufkratzer (talk) 16:57, 17 January 2022 (UTC)
- https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/184551712 —Preceding unsigned comment added by Polarbear w (talk • contribs) 18:50, 17 January 2022 (object changed to campus Jan 18, https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/1022247980)
- You mean outdoor=yes belongs to building=yes and indoor=yes belongs to leisure=sports_centre? --Hufkratzer (talk) 21:34, 17 January 2022 (UTC)
- Object could be large enough to be in both - imagine for example an artwork depicting snake that starts inside building, goes through window outside and continues for further 20 meters Mateusz Konieczny (talk) 22:37, 17 January 2022 (UTC)
- Nice picturesque example :-) For the climbing facility it is a bit simpler, it has climbing walls both indoor and outdoor. BTW I realized that the campus of the centre was not mapped yet, I'll transfer the sports_centre tags to the campus outline now. @Hufkratzer, how is that in the equestrian world, don't you have facilities where indoor and outdoor riding is possible? --Polarbear w (talk) 11:23, 18 January 2022 (UTC)
- Forunetely, there are no equestrian centres tagged with indoor=yes yet although many include an indoor arena (building=riding hall). In my opinion indoor=yes means that an object is completely indoors and not partly, and I think your addition is only confusing. --Hufkratzer (talk) 23:34, 22 December 2023 (UTC)
- Nice picturesque example :-) For the climbing facility it is a bit simpler, it has climbing walls both indoor and outdoor. BTW I realized that the campus of the centre was not mapped yet, I'll transfer the sports_centre tags to the campus outline now. @Hufkratzer, how is that in the equestrian world, don't you have facilities where indoor and outdoor riding is possible? --Polarbear w (talk) 11:23, 18 January 2022 (UTC)
- https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/184551712 —Preceding unsigned comment added by Polarbear w (talk • contribs) 18:50, 17 January 2022 (object changed to campus Jan 18, https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/1022247980)
Object inside building, but operated from outside
This atm is inside a building, but the front (display, keyboard etc) is outside. It is operated only from outside. https://www.openstreetmap.org/note/4036253#map=19/48.20753/16.17755&layers=N Would you call this indoor=yes? Nielkrokodil (talk) 18:43, 21 December 2023 (UTC)
- I would consider focus point of ATM where user interacts with it is indoor=no ? But I guess other options can be defended Mateusz Konieczny (talk) 23:28, 21 December 2023 (UTC)
- This is my opinion as well. I would focus on the end user / customer (who is outside) and not the operater (who is inside, when repairing etc) Nielkrokodil (talk) 06:32, 22 December 2023 (UTC)
- I would only use indoor=* or outdoor=* alone if it's completely indoors or outdoors (or not). indoor=yes + outdoor=yes has been mentioned, while this does not differentiate for the user, and there is an opposing opinion in the above section. This is more suitable to be expressed by on wall or window first, but support=* is not good. It's on the floor, only attached to the "glass curtain".
Fundamentally this shows 2 problems:- indoor=* is not extendable as an attribute due to overloading alongside indoor=* features. You can't add indoor=partial (not saying this should be used here) etc casually as covered=* . Considering the ongoing collision in location=* for the horizontal position with the vertical position, I have thought both *door=* and location:*door=* should be moved to eg location:*door=* , following location:transition=* . Then location:transition=* can expanded to cover horizontal transitions somehow for the question here.
- amenity=atm , amenity=vending_machine , etc has been specified for the machine, causing a gap for the functionality, especially when it's in a dedicated room or shop space. It would be better to have a man_made=* for the machine itself.
—— Kovposch (talk) 09:38, 23 December 2023 (UTC)
- I would only use indoor=* or outdoor=* alone if it's completely indoors or outdoors (or not). indoor=yes + outdoor=yes has been mentioned, while this does not differentiate for the user, and there is an opposing opinion in the above section. This is more suitable to be expressed by on wall or window first, but support=* is not good. It's on the floor, only attached to the "glass curtain".
- This is my opinion as well. I would focus on the end user / customer (who is outside) and not the operater (who is inside, when repairing etc) Nielkrokodil (talk) 06:32, 22 December 2023 (UTC)
- It's at least covered=yes
—— Kovposch (talk) 09:30, 23 December 2023 (UTC)